I am taking a class this semester that deals a lot with relationships and how men and women communicate. We recently started talking about the famous "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus" ideas. This term was coined by author John Gray and Mr. Gray has made a killing through his book and seminars that tell his listeners why their relationship may not be working. I was unfamiliar with the content of these books and was slightly horrified when I learned what they are teaching. Gray outlines ways in which to communicate with a man:
Only speak for two minutes
Speak only about one topic at a time
Provide few, if any, details
Be aware that revealing emotions may cause him to pull away
Appreciate him for listening
No eye contact
Expect interruptions
I was appalled by the way Gray says women should talk to men. It seems that Gray thinks that in order to communicate with a man you should treat him like a five year old. I was very confused by "Be aware of revealing emotions". How are we supposed to get close to anyone without revealing our emotions and thoughts? Another that bothered me was that women are supposed to reward men for listening. Should we reward him with sex just because he listened for two minutes? What kind of message is that sending to men? Do what I want and I'll put out? While sex is a huge motivational tool I do not think it should be used just to get your partner to listen to you. I know a lot of people follow John Gray and really connect with what he is preaching, but I think it is completely bogus.
What do you guys think? Should we use sex in relationships to get what we want? Is sharing emotions bad for your relationship? If a man is aloof and uncommunicative what would be the motivation for fixing a relationship if women just accept that "that's how men are"?
Only speak for two minutes
Speak only about one topic at a time
Provide few, if any, details
Be aware that revealing emotions may cause him to pull away
Appreciate him for listening
No eye contact
Expect interruptions
I was appalled by the way Gray says women should talk to men. It seems that Gray thinks that in order to communicate with a man you should treat him like a five year old. I was very confused by "Be aware of revealing emotions". How are we supposed to get close to anyone without revealing our emotions and thoughts? Another that bothered me was that women are supposed to reward men for listening. Should we reward him with sex just because he listened for two minutes? What kind of message is that sending to men? Do what I want and I'll put out? While sex is a huge motivational tool I do not think it should be used just to get your partner to listen to you. I know a lot of people follow John Gray and really connect with what he is preaching, but I think it is completely bogus.
What do you guys think? Should we use sex in relationships to get what we want? Is sharing emotions bad for your relationship? If a man is aloof and uncommunicative what would be the motivation for fixing a relationship if women just accept that "that's how men are"?
I would agree with you in the sense that the way he describes talked to a guy is like a five year old. How do you talk with someone for only two min and make sure no emotion is present? The no eye contact part is interesting to me also. I have grown up with parents to have taught me how to present yourself to someone and eye contact is a huge role in respect from the person whom you are holding a discussion with. In addition to just talking to someone having a relationship is completely different. If you are spending the rest of your life with someone then the guidelines he presented do not seem suitable. Now don't quote me on my next statement but in my health psychology class a couple semesters ago we discusses the emotional relationship that a female has by nature. And if a male is married by the time he is 25 it is predicted that he will live up the 10 years longer. The reason for this is because he has a female there providing the emotional aspect someone needs. Dealing with your emotions can relieve a lot of stress and increase your health. I would be interested to see what a guy has to say about this.
I’ve never read Gray’s book so I can’t say for certain what he means or what his intentions are, but I’m a guy so I’ll give you my definitions of the following:
1. Only speak for two minutes – I’d say this refers to only two minutes at a time. Catch your breath, take a sip of water and give us guys a second to add “I can’t believe that, really?” or a “Wow, that’s awesome.” It’s not that you have to tell us everything in only two minutes you just have to realize us guys are big dumb animals, we need some time to register what’s being said.
2. Speak only about one topic at a time – If you start talking about the new shoes/purse you bought and your day at work/school at the same time we’ll get the stories confused. Again, we’re big dumb animals. This is why sports seasons hardly overlap. We can’t talk about baseball during football season because it’s just too damn confusing.
3. Provide few, if any, details – The Reader’s Digest version of what happened is more informative than you realize. Besides, you have girlfriends to fill in all the details. Example: My friend and his wife had their first baby last week. I told a female friend about this and she started asking me how much the baby weighed, what time it was born, how the wife was doing. I said “I think they named her Sofie.” In other words, the baby is here and doing fine, that’s the core concept us guys need to know.
4. Be aware that revealing emotions may cause him to pull away – Why are you crying? Is it something I did? Shit, it had to be something I did. Oh, you’re crying because you’re happy? Now I’m not sure if it was something I did. We guys are wired to see things in black and white, women have the privilege of seeing things in color.
5. Appreciate him for listening – The game starts in 10 minutes. I’ve really got nothing to do until then. How was your day today?
6. No eye contact – This one is confusing because eye contact is good. Penetrating death stares aren’t.
7. Expect interruptions – They’re not really interruptions, just refer to the response in question 1.
I appreciate Brett's comment, since it provides a male's perspective on the issue. I think it's really important that men weight in on this topic because otherwise, all the women will be speculating on all they why's, how's, etc. without really knowing what the guys think about it all.
I found another article that summarizes some aspects of communication between men and women. They way you write about Gray's book in your post, it does seem like he portrays men like 5 year olds, and I hope that it's just because it's taken out of larger context. I hope as you read more, he expands a bit like Brett did, otherwise I'd say that it's not a very good book.
As for using sex as a motivational/bargaining tool, I think that's definitely a bad thing. First of all, it's incredibly selfish to withold a joint activity (like sex) as a way to get what one individual wants. Relationships are about teamwork and oneness, not having one's own way and only working to get what the other has to offer. Also, if intimate communication problems are present, witholding the sexual form of intimacy isn't going to help the overall situation.
Here's the link. It's not right-on in all aspects (in my opinion), but it provides some more information on the topic:
http://www.homestar.org/bryannan/tannen.html
I found this article to be very interesting and completely ridiculus. It's sad that people actually buy into this kind of stuff. First off all, women should not have to "train" men and follow certain instructions in order to get them to do what they should already want to do when they are in a relationship with a woman. Yes, women and men communicate differently, but in my opinion, these rules are not the way to go. Also, the suggestion that women should reward men with things like sex, in order to motivate them to listen to what women have to say is a bunch of crap. If a man is in a relationship where he cares about his partner and wants the relationship to last, he can put aside some time and communicate with his partner.
After reading this article I was searching the web for an article that related to this post. I found one that was written by a male therapist on how women should motivate men. Although I do not completely agree with everything he states, there are a few suggestions that I think would actually work to motivate men. The website is:
http://www.villagecounseling.net/motivatemen.shtml
If your interested in the topic, check it out.
What's your opinion on motivating men or from the original post, having to "train" men?
From what I read it is not really saying that we should reward them for listening...just let them know "hey I appreciate that you listened to me go on and on..." or "I'll let you watch the game and leave you alone now, thanks for listening". You wanted him to listen, he did, you appreciate that. He wants to watch some show, you let him without interruting, he appreciates that. I think sex has absolutely nothing to do with it!! For most people it seems like sex is a special thing between a man and a women when they are in a relationship and it is rewarding for both in many ways. It is not some act that should be FOR the guy and especially not some reward a women should feel she has to give him.
I think sharing emotions is something that is inevitable in a relationship. But the conversation of how was your day...yadda yadda doesn't need to be a pour your heart out event. Emotions will come out as they come out in some heart to heart conversations. Lets face it ladies guys might not be as emotional as us. Maybe that is biologically proven and maybe it is just what our society thinks.
I havn't really ever heard of this book, or the author. I haven't really read or looked into this but want to (so thanks for posting it). I am in between classes, read this, and just had an opinion.
Very interesting concept put forward by Gray here. I too, like many of the other people whom have commented on this post, have not read any of Gray’s books, however, my mother has read a few and if this is the sort of information he is giving out in his books then it is no wonder to me why my mother is still single.
I can’t believe that Gray, a male, would be saying this sort of stuff about other males and how women should interact with them in this sort of manner. I am not sure exactly in what context Gray’s information is meant to be applied, but if it is for dating purposes and first time interactions I believe that he must be intentionally trying to set women up for failure. The first point that Gray makes, only speak to men for two minutes at a time, is a rather foolish point to make. If you are limiting yourself to a very brief conversation with somebody, it is hard to see any sort of interesting topic developing between the conversation if your idea is to, “get in and out”, it hardly presents even the female doing the talking any time to even get her interests across and elaborated upon. The third point, providing few details, again fits into this point of the woman coming across as dull and uninteresting with very little to say if she is to follow through with Gray’s advice. The part that really bothered me though, and made Gray’s advice seem rather unsupportive, was the fact that he said, “Be aware that revealing emotions may cause him to pull away.” Although I believe that it would not be very attractive for a woman to spill her heart out to a man right away (and vice versa), not revealing any emotion at all seems to go against the type of communication patterns women seek out. Women seem to love self-disclosing information within one another and this can be seen as early as childhood with the notion of telling secrets as a means of power and intimacy amongst women. Self-disclosure is also what helps us move on from superficial relationships with an individual to having developed relationships with an individual. On top of this, men love having information being given to them straight, as studies have shown, men are not always able to recognize and differentiate between a women being nice and a women being interested. I believe that Gray’s ideas on this should be taken rather lightly, as, like I said, it would not be beneficial to spill one’s heart to anybody, but instead would be beneficial to show emotion in a very small, and yet with very straight-forward communication. The last point Gray makes, on men interrupting women, is completely insulting. In fact, I have found that sometimes women do not understand that conversation is a reciprocal activity. I have been in discussions with women I am extremely interested in, where they will end up talking without end for upwards of 3-4 minutes. In a case like this, people need to be interrupted in order to keep interest and spark new directions in a conversation, thee exact same point could be made to a member of either sex, not exclusively men.
In conclusion, John Gray is not benefiting my mother, or society, in any way.